Who Else?

[Paradox]

In this case, those who were banned were told to contact a forum administrator (which would be Mark/Chogon). As far as I know, everyone that emailed him has been unbanned.

What makes this worse is that it wasn't an actual forum ban, because the moderators don't have the power to do that. Instead, Veralun took advantage of the "anti-spam" measures and used his ability as a group admin to remove people from the group; silencing them without actually banning them.

As for taking it to higher levels, there was an email sent to Mark and RAWA back in March of last year. It called for Veralun to be removed from the moderation team, and was signed by several well known community members from a variety of groups (including myself, chucker (from MystCommunity), amonre/ddfreyne (who at the time was a Cyan intern), vidkid7, Whilyam, and Marein (from the Dutch Myst Community)). They never replied.

It was only when things escalated (and Whilyam started the original "Ending the Nonsense") that RAWA actually seemed to take interest in the issue, and his interest can be summed up as "We'll discuss it behind the scenes *lock thread*". Nothing appears to have actually changed, which is what makes me so doubtful that anything will change this time.

Mod Note: I merged Whilyam's "Ending the Nonsense (part 2)" topic with Hoikas's "Who else" topic. Let's not fill our forums with topics about another forum.

[Karkadann]

Im not so sure about telling them what to do with their employee's per-say they may have taken that the wrong way. what im suggesting is Just make sure the higher ups know whats going on down in the trenches. and they can decide for themselves what to do based on the information and evidence.

[Chacal]

I have a sneaking suspicion that veralun expects me to lash out as a result of being "banned" and get myself in even more hot water. Clever ploy.

Yeah, he's pretty clever: he can get our forum banner defaced anytime he wants.
So your sneaking suspicion isn't far from the truth.

[Tsar Hoikas]

[Ehren]

So, no one was banned from MOULa itself?

Are any of the people involved in this even still banned from the forum?

[Karkadann]

:roll:

So why give into it, if its an issue with one individual within a company why allow him to effect you. Why are you allowing him to disrupt your progress into open source and age creation How do you think he would react if no one responded to the his actions and we all just continued to work on open source or age creation or tutorials or what ever as if this was just a fly in the ointment

This is a site about creating age's from ones imagination not a college coarse in abnormal psychology. Just my option but I think we should get back to what this site is all about "Writing ages" and leave the psychology to the conspiracy web sites

[kaelisebonrai]

So, no one was banned from MOULa itself?

Are any of the people involved in this even still banned from the forum?

So, I take it from this you feel a moderator abusing an anti-spam measure to silence legitimate users is not a problem that needs to be dealt with.

[Karkadann]

So, no one was banned from MOULa itself?

Are any of the people involved in this even still banned from the forum?

So, I take it from this you feel a moderator abusing an anti-spam measure to silence legitimate users is not a problem that needs to be dealt with.

What Im saying is Yes it needs to be dealt with but our resources to deal with it being outside of the company are quit limited. Resources and time we usually use to work on age creation and open source are now being used for something I feel is unrelated. its distracting a lot of people from age creation and open source. As to whats motivating it is a whole other story.

Who are we to tell them what to do with their employee, Look at it from their point of view. . ITs not my place to discipline or decide what disciplinary action should be taken to someone else employee. that job belongs to the Admin of the company we can lodge a complaint we can inform them of the situation and hope they can make a well informed decision based on the information giving to them

He's pressing your buttons, whether its deliberate or not I do not know. perhaps its time to rewire those buttons or discontent them all together. open source is something we all have been fighting and waiting for and now we have it. Please don't allow this to Poison open source.

[kaelisebonrai]

So, no one was banned from MOULa itself?

Are any of the people involved in this even still banned from the forum?

So, I take it from this you feel a moderator abusing an anti-spam measure to silence legitimate users is not a problem that needs to be dealt with.

What Im saying is Yes it needs to be dealt with but our resources to deal with it being outside of the company are quit limited. Resources and time we usually use to work on age creation and open source are now being used for something I feel is unrelated. its distracting a lot of people from age creation and open source. As to whats motivating it is a whole other story.

Who are we to tell them what to do with their employee, Look at it from their point of view. . ITs not my place to discipline or decide what disciplinary action should be taken to someone else employee. that job belongs to the Admin of the company we can lodge a complaint we can inform them of the situation and hope they can make a well informed decision based on the information giving to them

He's pressing your buttons, whether its deliberate or not I do not know. perhaps its time to rewire those buttons or discontent them all together. open source is something we all have been fighting and waiting for and now we have it. Please don't allow this to Poison open source.

How to reply to this... lets start here.

1) Veralun is not an employee of Cyan, he is a volunteer moderator.

2) Two people spent a couple of minutes on the banner. Who are you to tell them how to spend their time?

3) Our actions did not affect work on open source projects at all.

4) If we do not stand up for ourselves, who will?

5) While Open Source may be technically here - we cannot use the code for much at all - the licensing issues prevent us from distributing binaries, and code that does not belong to cyan was licensed under the GPL - code they had no right to license this way - code belonging to a certain company that is very much not friendly to open source - Microsoft.

[Lontahv]

I've been considering the complaint that runs something like this "Why does Hoikas have the right to change the banner when it is only he who is being attacked on the MOUL forums," and I would like to respond. When this site was created, Cyan wanted there to be guild leadership: someone "official" they could talk to. Now, so many years later, that same Cyan has let Veralun have unchecked power to single out and abuse, and tear down the posts of one of our original leaders. Because of the role Hoikas has here, I can not help but take any unfounded and vindictive moderation as an attack against not only him, but against the whole guild. Therefore, those who say that this matter does not concern them should think long and hard. This is like a shot across the bows: Cyan has enabled Veralun to attack our guild by attacking one of the people who represents us. Hoikas is one of the people who speaks for the guild; stifling him stifles one third of the guild's official voice on the MOUL forums.