Known Issue - Minkata Boots

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Re: Known Issue - Minkata Boots

Postby janaba » Sun Nov 03, 2013 9:02 am

Annabelle wrote:
janaba wrote:This is hilarious, Sirius ... is that a joke or is it really so, and only for male avatars, as I never noticed such distortions on my female avatar ? ... :lol:
Type either "/bow" or "/beckonsmall" & try not to laugh. The better spots to do these actions are let say in Age Maps Gallery right were the camera do an extreme close-up in front of the D'ni-Ae'gura map :)

The facial expressions were surprisingly fitting to that musical piece ... :lol:
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Re: Known Issue - Minkata Boots

Postby Sirius » Sun Nov 03, 2013 2:23 pm

janaba wrote:is that a joke or is it really so, and only for male avatars, as I never noticed such distortions on my female avatar ? ... :lol:
It's really what happens when converting MOUL files... :lol:

Hmmm... Female avatars are not affected, though.
I guess that's because male have 2 more bones in MOUL than originally in CC, while female have the same number of bones in both versions... (interesting application of Darwin's theory, is it not ? :D)
Plasma must store vertices as groups, affected by the transformation of bone n°X, where X is the index of the bone in a bone list... Since there are two more bones in this list, it finds bone X+2 or X-2... and ends up screwing it all.

Somehow some anims from MOUL have the same problem, and I remember female avatars somehow end up with weird eyes... :shock:
But my favorite is /dance2 for male avatars: the arms and head shrink and warp inside the torso. Turtle-like effect.
what did I say about Darwin already ?

If you want to reproduce this effect, start Drizzle, go to Advanced→Manual Conversion→MOUL→Process a single file, and choose GlobalClothing_District_Male.prp.
For the ladies, don't forget to change your avatar to Male (/avatar Male)

Special thanks to the board for eating my whole post when I clicked "Submit"
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Re: Known Issue - Minkata Boots

Postby GPNMilano » Sun Nov 03, 2013 3:26 pm

I guess I'll chime in on this too:

One of the reasons that converting clothing for the males takes so long, and the update to DI for new clothing took longer than I'd posted was cause of the additional clothing for the males. Unlike with the females where I can just export, convert it to POTS and try it out, for males there's an additional step of manually editing the PRP after conversion to fix the issues with them.

Some interesting facts about how the clothing works:

First, there's not just one piece of clothing. For most clothing items there's actually three versions. A hi-res, med-res and low res version. These are stored in the plSharedMesh. I believe it's called that, or something close, doesn't matter as this is just a basic explanation anyhoo...back to it...there's three versions of the mesh because to save loading in a multi-player environment the mesh will change based on the distance the avatar is from the camera. Farther away the avatar is from your camera, it'll load the lower res versions till it gets to the lowest and stays there. Avatar comes closer to the camera, and it loads from lowest to highest etc. In a single player mode it doesn't matter as there's only ever you, and the camera generally stays pretty close to you. But in the city for instance, if you could look from one area of the city to the other and see the explorers, say from the top of the staircase down to the ferry terminal, you're actually seeing lowerres versions of the clothing. The lower res versions obviously having less vertexes and faces.

Besides the three meshes for the clothing itself, there's also two additional meshes that make up the plMorphDataSet. This is what controls the size of the avatar, and controlled by the Build scroll bar in avatar customization. And of course, though most clothing options don't have this, you can make more than one build set depending on the desired resolution of the closet item. So potentially every piece of clothing could have a total 9 meshes that make up just the one item. Of course most clothing items luckily only have the MorphDataSet to adjust, the high res version. Some have a medium res version but mostly it's just the one MorphDataSet for each clothing item.

So...why this affects the males only is cause of the additional bones. As Sirrus pointed out some of this information is stored in groups etc, and the additional bones screw up with the sort order of the groups. However with some clothing items for males you can get around this by manually fixing the prps using plMorphDataSets and plSharedMesh's from the POTS prps, as many clothing items share the same information anyway. So you could have multiple types of clothing but they all use the same mesh's and just switch out textures. But if it's a new item, like the Minkata boots that don't use the same plMorphDataSet's and plSharedMesh's as the other shoes and boots...it's impossible to fix.

Hopefully that explains the issue..somewhat.
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Re: Known Issue - Minkata Boots

Postby janaba » Sun Nov 03, 2013 4:41 pm

Sirius wrote: ... Somehow some anims from MOUL have the same problem, and I remember female avatars somehow end up with weird eyes... :shock:
But my favorite is /dance2 for male avatars: the arms and head shrink and warp inside the torso. Turtle-like effect.
what did I say about Darwin already ?
If you want to reproduce this effect, start Drizzle, go to Advanced→Manual Conversion→MOUL→Process a single file, and choose GlobalClothing_District_Male.prp.
For the ladies, don't forget to change your avatar to Male (/avatar Male)

Before vanishing into dreamland and higher dimensionalities I decided to try that out, means changing from female to male with com. '/avatar male' and then com. '/dance2' haha, OMG, one really must do it and see it to believe it ... :lol:

Thanks for the fun and thanks all, Sirius and GPNMilano, for the extensive explanation why this is all so ... :)
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