I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

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I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby DreamBliss » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:25 pm

Well I have Cmake installed and Python 3 64-bit. Turns out I need something called cmakelists.txt in order to build the PyPRP with Cmake. I'm not seeing it in the package or finding it anywhere. I have no idea how to make this file myself. Could someone help me out here, and if this is not the right way build a 64-bit version of PyPRP. could you point me in the right direction?

Thank you!
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby tachzusamm » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:00 am

Umm...
PyPRP is a collection of Python scripts. Python scripts, however, run directly as they are, under control of the Python interpreter. Python scripts are readable, because they are source code. So PyPRP does not need to be "build" or something like that. It can be used just as it is.
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby Lyrositor » Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:07 am

Also, CMake isn't a compiler; it generates build files for your compiler (GCC, Visual Studio, etc.). Even if PyPRP could be compiled, you'd still need a compiler such as Visual Studio for Windows.
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby DreamBliss » Mon Jun 17, 2013 2:57 am

I guess I misunderstood what someone said...

Err... So technically PyPRP should work in Blender 64 and 32? Or am I missing something here?

Well I figured out that the last version of Blender that would accept PyPRP is Blender 2.64. So I guess I could just install the 64-bit version and see what happens.

Hey, thank you for setting me straight on this! Man this whole programming thing is fast becoming a pain in the arse. I swear, not only do I have to learn C++ (or some other language), but I also have to learn DirectX, Microsoft Shader, and all this SVN stuff and its associated language! I think in an attempt to make things easier or more convenient programmers have actually made things very difficult for folks like me. Not like it was back when Carmack began to plug away on Doom and Wolfenstien!

OK, I swear I'm done ranting... At least for the moment...
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby Christopher » Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:15 am

DreamBliss wrote:programmers have actually made things very difficult for folks like me.


Why did they make it difficult? Sure you have to learn how this stuff works, but the tutorials on the wiki page a pretty good. I mean 3ds Max also seems to be very difficult... until you know how to work with it.

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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby Lyrositor » Mon Jun 17, 2013 5:38 am

DreamBliss wrote:I swear, not only do I have to learn C++ (or some other language), but I also have to learn DirectX, Microsoft Shader, and all this SVN stuff and its associated language!

I don't see why you'd need to learn C++, Direct, Microsoft Shader or SVN (especially since as far as I know none of us use Subversion).

It might be easier for you to drop by our IRC channel on irc.justirc.net; we're not always online, but if you login and wait, we should eventually surface and be able to answer your questions in live-time.
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby DreamBliss » Mon Jun 17, 2013 10:46 pm

Sorry for the confusion... My little rant there was referring to programming in general. I wasn't referring to programming for Uru specifically.

It's just that when I got this dumb idea to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP I did some looking around at what it takes to build something in CMake, for example, and you have to make this whole CMake file with its own language and everything. I recalled also watching some video tutorials, trying to learn about drawing primitive shapes in C++, and it went into all this detail about DirectX, the MS Shader language, a bunch of other stuff. As I am trying to learn C++ it just makes everything seem harder. My hill suddenly became a mountain!

Not related in any direct way to Uru. Just some exposure to CMake building my own client, all the stuff I had to go through doing that, and thinking about the editor I would eventually like to make for Uru. I can't get discouraged, but it sure seems like more and more of a monumental task the further down this rabbit hole I get.

Anyhow I hope that clarifies things... I'm working on several things at once here... Age building for Max, which I think I understand, age building for Blender is next, and learning how to program so someday I can make an editor. Think of me like Hammy the squirrel from Over the Hedge. Working super fast, jumping from one thing to the next. I apologize if I confuse anyone.
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby Christopher » Tue Jun 18, 2013 2:23 am

DreamBliss wrote:in CMake, for example, and you have to make this whole CMake file with its own language and everything.

This actually make things easier if you are working on a cross platform project. With the help of CMake you don't have to write make files for every compiler (VS, gcc,...). You only have to write the CMake file once and the rest is done by CMake. If you want to make your project for Windows only, you probably don't need CMake.

DreamBliss wrote:I recalled also watching some video tutorials, trying to learn about drawing primitive shapes in C++, and it went into all this detail about DirectX, the MS Shader language, a bunch of other stuff.

I wouldn't start with rendering things to learn C++. That's like going to a lecture about quantum physics in a language you just started to learn.
You first have to master the language. There are good books and tutorials out there. I doubt you can learn C++ from video tutorials... If you know how C++ works then you can start looking at DirectX or OpenGL or what ever. Again there are a lot of good books about it out there.

DreamBliss wrote:and thinking about the editor I would eventually like to make for Uru. I can't get discouraged, but it sure seems like more and more of a monumental task

It's a giant task, especially if you just start learning C++. I would suggest you to first start with some smaller programs, to understand C++ properly.
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby Mystler » Tue Jun 18, 2013 3:59 am

I'd also recommend you start learning C++ with some easier libraries like Qt or an engine like Ogre, if you want some initial experience with 3D programs.
Don't try to learn everything at once. Do it step by step.

Anyway, I think this thread is getting a bit off topic.
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Re: I would like to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP

Postby Deledrius » Tue Jun 18, 2013 1:39 pm

DreamBliss wrote:Well I have Cmake installed and Python 3 64-bit. Turns out I need something called cmakelists.txt in order to build the PyPRP with Cmake. I'm not seeing it in the package or finding it anywhere. I have no idea how to make this file myself. Could someone help me out here, and if this is not the right way build a 64-bit version of PyPRP. could you point me in the right direction?

Thank you!


PyPRP doesn't use CMake, and is not built. It's a collection of scripts. You do need CMake to build libHSPlasma, but it comes with a pre-made CMakeLists.txt because it would be useless to expect you to build one yourself (it contains the instructions on how to create the build scripts in various systems). PyPRP1.x does not use libHSPlasma, so this is irrelevant.

DreamBliss wrote:Err... So technically PyPRP should work in Blender 64 and 32? Or am I missing something here?

I'm not aware of any specific dependency of PyPRP1.x that is 32-bit only.

DreamBliss wrote:Hey, thank you for setting me straight on this! Man this whole programming thing is fast becoming a pain in the arse. I swear, not only do I have to learn C++ (or some other language), but I also have to learn DirectX, Microsoft Shader, and all this SVN stuff and its associated language! I think in an attempt to make things easier or more convenient programmers have actually made things very difficult for folks like me. Not like it was back when Carmack began to plug away on Doom and Wolfenstien!

There is no need to learn C++, DirectX, Shaders, or SVN if you are interested in making Ages. You will need a basic understanding of YAML if you're using PyPRP1.x (this is thankfully not the case in PyPRP2 and Korman), and it will be important to understand how the Plasma engine works in general as well (e.g. What an Age is, how SDL is used by your Ages, what Python scripts are used for, etc.). You're making things a lot more complicated for yourself by worrying about a lot of things which are not in the least relevant unless you intend to contribute to the engine or the tools.

Also, Carmack was a mad scientist and I don't think anything he did on those projects could even remotely be considered non-difficult. ;)

DreamBliss wrote:It's just that when I got this dumb idea to build a 64-bit version of PyPRP I did some looking around at what it takes to build something in CMake, for example, and you have to make this whole CMake file with its own language and everything. I recalled also watching some video tutorials, trying to learn about drawing primitive shapes in C++, and it went into all this detail about DirectX, the MS Shader language, a bunch of other stuff. As I am trying to learn C++ it just makes everything seem harder. My hill suddenly became a mountain!

This isn't a hill nor a mountain you need to climb, not right now, unless I misunderstand your goals. I'd suggest becoming familiar with Plasma first if you intend to go that route.

DreamBliss wrote:Just some exposure to CMake building my own client, all the stuff I had to go through doing that, and thinking about the editor I would eventually like to make for Uru. I can't get discouraged, but it sure seems like more and more of a monumental task the further down this rabbit hole I get.

It would be an impossible task to make a working editor until you fully understood the process of building Ages as a start. Take it one task at a time and you'll be fine. There's usually someone around in #writers to answer questions (and if not, ask anyway and it'll be answered when we return).

DreamBliss wrote:Anyhow I hope that clarifies things... I'm working on several things at once here... Age building for Max, which I think I understand, age building for Blender is next, and learning how to program so someday I can make an editor. Think of me like Hammy the squirrel from Over the Hedge. Working super fast, jumping from one thing to the next. I apologize if I confuse anyone.

I think you're risking having an overly-broad and very shallow understanding if you do it this way. This is a very large engine, and the processes involved in Age creation are not trivial. It requires, above anything, patience, as well as artistic talent and logical thinking. My recommendation is to pick a tool, either 3D Studio Max or Blender, and make a simple Age with it. Stick to that tool while adding more to that Age as you learn new things and have new ideas. Get to know what you can and cannot do. Once you've done that you'll be in a better position to accomplish your goals, as well as contributing here!

I'm not trying to discourage you, just suggesting perhaps you slow down a bit and focus more. We're here to help, and that's hard to do if you don't stick to any topic long enough to learn the solutions. Be careful when jumping to conclusions when faced with a problem you don't understand: it can prevent you from discovering the real answers.
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