BLUE GARDEN project

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BLUE GARDEN project

Postby Zesty of Xeniphers » Wed Aug 16, 2017 3:05 am

hello everyone

this thread is dedicated to the age called BLUE GARDEN, which was a vision and a dream of our dear friend, explorer and age builder - WAMDUSKASAPA - who sadly passed away in February this year.

Wam started to build this age in cooperation with Dendwaler (i just learned that), and later on, upon my suggestion, Dulcamara.

shortly after Wam passed away i approached Doobes and he agreed to work on this age and finish it.

if Dendwaler has the time to work on this age now, he is most welcome to help Doobes. if not, i suggest he gives the material to Doobes so that he can finish it because he has the time for it now. all involved should be properly credited, even if they decide they don't have the time to continue to work on this age.

as i have mentioned in the other thread, i was not technically involved in building the age, but i DO know the story, Wam's story, very well. we were close friends, talked on Skype every day for several years, and we did discuss his age many times, adding ideas, discussing details etc. i have music, pictures and artwork that should be included in the age.

the most important thing is that we start working on it, knowing who is doing what and help a fellow explorer realize his dream.
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Re: BLUE GARDEN project

Postby Kirk of Xeniphers » Wed Aug 16, 2017 7:34 am

Hi Folks, I think it would be nice if everyone concerned could work together on this project , or if they wish not to , pass on the age material to Doobes who is willing to do it for us........ :)
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Re: BLUE GARDEN project

Postby Zesty of Xeniphers » Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:00 am

we would love to hear your thoughts on this Dendweler. we would certainly like to include you in the project, as it seems you have been in it from the very beginning. (i am sorry that i learned about this just a few days ago). if you have the time for it, of course. so please let us know.
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Re: BLUE GARDEN project

Postby dendwaler » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:01 am

I received your Pm Zesty.
Once i opened it, you started this new thread before i had time to answer, within a few hours.

Right here you write:
if Dendwaler has the time to work on this age now, he is most welcome to help Doobes.


What? .. i started the building, back in 2013 when Wam asked me to do that.
And now i am forced to stop, hand it over to Doobes and start helping Doobes on behalve of a selfinstalled projectleader ?
No way thats going to happen.

So i had to overthink how to respond on your PM.
Its hard to explain my feelings about this, especialy because English is not my first language.

You say:
as you can see i started this project after my dear friend Wamduskasapa passed away in February.
i did not know about your involvement.
i knew it was someone, but i didn't know it was you. so sorry about that.


At first glance it seems reasonable to accept this excuses.

Unfortunately i know that it is not true.
You did know i was the builder because Dulcamara told it to you TWICE!
First time after she received the files in 2016, because she had recognized the copied coding from turtle isle.
But you did not believe her and you did not accept that Wam could not use Blender, when she told you.

Then you continue:
however the most important thing right now is to continue and finish the project.
i approached Doobes and he said he has the time to do it now.
(if i knew that you worked on this age, i would contact you first).


Dulcamara told you again that i was working on it or at least did work on it.
and still you did not contact me first.

However you continue your PM in a much better more acceptable way:

so Dendwaler, do you have the time to work on it right now ?
if you do have the time to work on BLUE GARDEN now and finish it, then that's great news.
you can count on me and Doobes to help you with it.
if not, i think it would be only fair to give the material to Doobes so that he can finish the age.
he started working on it, but i fear he feels discouraged now.
please let me know as soon as you can. thanks.


There you stated your offer to help me, instead of the other way around, a much better approach.
That implies that I will still be leading and build it in my own speed.

So its not "starting" and "finishing" but continue_ing in the way i already did.
Its not about including me in your project, its about including you into our project.(Our = Wam and Me)

I accept no pressure from you or anyone to finish it "soon" in either way.
Its ready when it is ready.
And since i am the only builder, nobody rules my Time.
This might easily take me another few years , i have a family life and i am mortal too.
The Cathedral costed me 3 years to build, 5 hours a day, on daily base.
The Blue Garden will not be less work.

I might need help from time to time, it depends on how to progress.
I don't need buildinghelp from Doobes if its completely builded in 2.49b of Blender as it is now.
However if it has to be build for the Gehnshard this has to switch to Blender 2.79 or (2.78 for Korman.)
I might fall back on Doobes experience on this point.
Using Blender 2.79 itself is not an issue for me.
I probably still can't use the shadowmaps Doobes made, because this area is different in texturing anyway and there are new objects in it.
I was hesitating to use Korman again, because i failed with its former version in realation with animating and the shortcomings related to
what is done in 2.49b by scripting.
I also would like to be able to use more then 1 page instead of the "mainRoom" alone for several reasons.
Anyway Korman can be used perfectly as long its a static age, as it formerly was.

Storywise i might need help, but not yet now, i have plenty to do for many many month.
and i can use a cooldown period.

To end this post i will reveal a snippet of a PM from Wamduskasapa to me
It might clear up some things for you.

Show Spoiler



I cooperated with Wam and helped him, it was a slow process.
I promised not to post nor share any builded content to others.
It was his privalage to post or share whatever he wanted. (may be he did with you.)
This was to give him the max fun in creating the Blue Garden.

I still keep that promise,
i did not let him down,
i still build
and I do share nothing with others.
Those wonderfull Worlds are called " Ages" , because that is what it takes to build one.

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Watch my latest Video Or even better..... watch the Cathedral's Complete Walkthrough made by Suleika!
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Re: BLUE GARDEN project

Postby Zesty of Xeniphers » Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:20 am

what i said is true, however i see you are accusing me of lying. after this, i don't think i wish to continue getting involved in this. this project should have been a tribute to my dear friend. he of all people would not like this to turn into a battle and accusing people, especially not me. i started this in honor of Wamduskasapa, not for myself. i have life and my own ongoing projects and very little time for much else, especially not internet ego-battles and slander. if you wish to continue working with what you have it is up to you, but i am not going to take any part in it, not this way. this is very much upsetting me and soiling the memory of my dear friend. it should not be done this way. nothing should be done this way.

although i did not know about your involvement, i apologized, but that was not enough to you. fine. however it was strange that Wam never mentioned you and your involvement to me, not even once, and we spoke about his project many many times. and also that you know how many times and when exactly Dulcamara told me something i have no idea about. wow ! you seem to know everything about everyone and i hardly know how to spell your name correctly, it is how much i know about you. to illustrate how your words are accurate, i am quoting Dulcamara's words from another thread " Wamduskasapa sent me in Januar 2016 one blendfile, sounds and textures (via Skype). Zesty have had asked me to work in advance for Wamduskasapa. Wam had not say that the work was from you." so how could she tell me when she didn't know about your involvement herself ?

and if you are interested why i started this thread, it is because it was my initiative to bring people together to finish Wam's age, back then in February when Wam passed. as i did everything else, from making sure his name goes to Memorial Wheel, in MOULa and the shards, to organizing tribute events etc. i don't think i have to ask anyone for permission. Blue Garden was HIS age, Wam's age after all. Wam was my close friend and i did this for him.

and one thing why i find this discussion disgraceful is because Wam is not around to take a part in it. everyone can say whatever they want now. one more reason to stay away from this. this is not for Wam and this is NOT what he would want. you can continue his age any way you wish, but it won't be Wam's age anymore because you don't know the story which should have been the very heart of that age and the most important part of it.

finally, let me remind you, this project was supposed to be about Wam, not about you, or me or anyone else. apparently all of us had a PART of the age Wam wanted to build. and only TOGETHER we could make it close to what he wanted it to be - for HIM, not for us. i don't see how you insisting on working alone and with only a part that you have, are respecting the memory of Wam. and for secrecy, sadly, you made sure nothing is secret anymore.

with sad heart, i am going out of it now, first and foremost because Wam did not deserve this and nor did i. this kind of accusations and ill feelings is not what i need in my life and Wam would not want that for me. and certainly this kind of atmosphere is not a way to create anything.

so i will keep Wam's story about his age in my heart as a very personal memory. RIP Wam.
Last edited by Zesty of Xeniphers on Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: BLUE GARDEN project

Postby dendwaler » Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:24 am

We both gave our points of view.
We both made our choises.
I do respect yours, and i agree that any further arguiing does not make sens.
Those wonderfull Worlds are called " Ages" , because that is what it takes to build one.

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