Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Anything that isn't directly related to Age Creation but that might be interesting to Age developers.

Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Sirius » Wed Feb 12, 2020 12:07 pm

Ehren wrote:WHOA! The diving underwater thing is crazy!

Whoah, wait, wait, what ?
*Checks old save files are present, and boots up DiRT*
*Forgot which key is diving, game crashes anyway*
*Reboots, dives underwater, tries to fight the current for 10 minutes without ever surfacing for breath*

So cool ! Well, yeah, the controls are bad - I'm glad you explained those in your post, not sure I would have figured out otherwise. (Although to be honest, I feel underwater controls often sucked in games of this time.) I dislike how strong the current is, though - it takes forever to swim upstream, and even then I never had the patience to see if there was anything at the end of the cave.
By the way, did anyone notice the avatar's ARMS have actual collision ? It explains why running against walls feels so jerky. It's even more noticeable underwater due to the wide arm swings.
I love the underwater kelp, though - it's really the nice touch a few Ages are lacking...

Ehren wrote:I'm new to any sort of photo manipulation.

When dealing with dark images, I recommend trying to take screenshots in a lossless format like PNG. JPEG completely destroys dark areas, hence the blocky look of your image. Once you brightened it up and boosted the contrast, then you can save as JPEG, as artifacts are weaker on high-contrast and "noisy" images.

sarpedon2 wrote:Anyone know what was suppose to be after the Bug Cave?

Dunno, but knowing Cyan there is definitely more stuff after that - if not already modeled, then probably in concept arts somewhere. It seems Tweek has a slightly more recent version, maybe he knows (although he may not want to spoil the surprise, which I understand :) )

sarpedon2 wrote:Also while the 3rd person camera is not to everyone's liking (it can make maneuvering difficult compared to first person), it really does enhance the scale of the environments, certainly the Bug Cave with the almost oppressive darkness

Oh yeah, the bug cave was something with all the sheer darkness everywhere. I don't understand why the Myst V version of the Tiwah has all that weird greenish fog when it was pitch black in DiRT... WTF.
As for the camera itself; I usually dislike 3rd person camera or prefer a closer-up view, but I still thoroughly enjoyed the one in the demo. It's not perfect, but really works well with the whole environment.
To be honest, I occasionally switch to 3rd person view in Uru, and I'm still surprised by how nice it looks in some areas.
The controls in the demo, though... those are quite representative of games of this time, but WTF, it feels like piloting a goddamn truck. I'm glad we got mousedrive in Uru.

Ehren wrote:Really want to be able to drive the Scarab now, wonder what it looks like whole.

Again, I can only recommend playing Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis. It's not exactly Myst, but it really gets D'ni/DiRT-ish near the end. You can find it for cheap on gog.com. Unless I'm biased due to playing it in my childhood, it's still a wonderful game that aged well.
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Deledrius » Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:18 pm

Sirius wrote:
Ehren wrote:Really want to be able to drive the Scarab now, wonder what it looks like whole.

Again, I can only recommend playing Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis. It's not exactly Myst, but it really gets D'ni/DiRT-ish near the end. You can find it for cheap on gog.com. Unless I'm biased due to playing it in my childhood, it's still a wonderful game that aged well.

Haha, you're right! I hadn't thought about it, but they've got a nice similarity going on.
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Théodore » Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:39 pm

Hi,

Concerning DiRT's Descent, deep underground there is a broken bridge. I've been trying everything to get through that area with no success yet.

1) jumping directly on the next section of the bridge, the gap widden and then, once back up from the stream below on the entry side, I cannot jump anymore ahead without falling in the stream below;
2) jumping gently on the rim of the bridge to the next section, this way the bridge doesn't crumble but then I cannot jump back any further to reach the lever next to the close gate to exit that area;
3) (when bugged) climbing the ladder from the other side of the stream, I just keep climbing and climbing until I'm stuck. Each and every time I'm trying to get off the ladder, the animation brings me all the way back down near the stream at the bottom of the ladder;
4) (seldomly when apparently the ladder animation is not bugged) climbing the ladder from the other side of the stream, my avatar goes right underneath the manhole hatch and tries to open it with no success.

I have no idea what lies beyond that area but from what I gathered from the messages so far there would be the great tree and the bug cave. I'm sure many already crossed that area succesfully, any help would be welcomed!

Thank you!
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Ehren » Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:49 pm

Théodore wrote:Hi,

Concerning DiRT's Descent, deep underground there is a broken bridge. I've been trying everything to get through that area with no success yet.

1) jumping directly on the next section of the bridge, the gap widden and then, once back up from the stream below on the entry side, I cannot jump anymore ahead without falling in the stream below;
2) jumping gently on the rim of the bridge to the next section, this way the bridge doesn't crumble but then I cannot jump back any further to reach the lever next to the close gate to exit that area;
3) (when bugged) climbing the ladder from the other side of the stream, I just keep climbing and climbing until I'm stuck. Each and every time I'm trying to get off the ladder, the animation brings me all the way back down near the stream at the bottom of the ladder;
4) (seldomly when apparently the ladder animation is not bugged) climbing the ladder from the other side of the stream, my avatar goes right underneath the manhole hatch and tries to open it with no success.

I have no idea what lies beyond that area but from what I gathered from the messages so far there would be the great tree and the bug cave. I'm sure many already crossed that area succesfully, any help would be welcomed!

Thank you!


On the half of the bridge that you're on, walk along the VERY left edge of the bridge (the side with a door lever), once you walk into the right spot you should get a new perspective to help you.
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Sirius » Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:45 am

(Not sure I understand Ehren's tip, so I'll add my own)

If I understand and remember correctly, that's the part where you MUST fall in the river. The bridge and hatches lead nowhere. Once you're down in the stream, let the current carry you to some big grate - it can actually be climbed. You can't miss the grate, but it took me a while to notice it's climbable.
Do save often, though. You're reaching the buggiest part of the demo, so any wrong move can make your avatar stuck.

(oh, and I'm not sure if I mentioned it earlier - you can jump down from some ladders by pressing spacebar. Faster than actually climbing down.)
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Théodore » Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:18 am

Wow ok... I have 2 different answers. I'll try them both. I went all the way downstream and at one point near the grates instead of swimming I was standing up, there's some hope. I can surely walk to the very tip of the first half of the bridge, that's where I'm doing my jump to land on the other half without breaking it. I'm suspecting now that the other half isn't meant to be reachable which would explain my 100ish attempts to reach something on that side with no success.

I should remind me that I'm not playing in a normal "uru" environment i.e. the obvious is not necessarily the right way.

I'm saving like crazy! I might have 10 saved games, 1 after each "big" action during the descent.

Thanks to both of you! :)
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby sarpedon2 » Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:15 am

Deledrius wrote:What are the faults you think need addressing?


Well from experience of playing Uru, controls in third person where pretty clunky, particularly as it come into conflict with the camera positioning. Hard to steer the avatar in the direction you wanted. So there is a conflict between having a third person which uses camera angles to enhance the sense of scale in the environment (something Uru's first person mode detracted from), and having a good way of steering the avatar throughout the world. In my opinion, the best way to solve this conflict would be to have a console type controller system, which would allow you to walk, run, jump, action button and use an inventory quite quickly. Its a shame Uru was never ported to a console (then again no console at the time was powerful enough to run it, PS4 still can't match PC when it comes to Obduction).
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Ehren » Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:10 pm

Sirius wrote:(Not sure I understand Ehren's tip, so I'll add my own)


Guess I was trying too hard to make it just a hint. What I was going for was that there is a camera angle change at just the right spot that gives you an overall view of the grate area that you are talking about. You can even see the pipes if you look carefully.
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Théodore » Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:14 pm

I got as far as everyone! The bug cave is our deadend. Great little demo. I wish they would have used more material from this demo in Myst 5 EOA and URU. Oh well, at least we can play it 19 years after :)
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Re: Nexus demo, DiRT's Descent, and Hector's Cove !

Postby Sirius » Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:25 am

Ehren wrote:What I was going for was that there is a camera angle change at just the right spot that gives you an overall view of the grate area that you are talking about. You can even see the pipes if you look carefully.

Ah ok, I understand now :)

sarpedon2 wrote:In my opinion, the best way to solve this conflict would be to have a console type controller system, which would allow you to walk, run, jump, action button and use an inventory quite quickly.

Agreed. DiRT was made in the weird era where "tank" steering was the norm. Controllers eventually brought more natural third-person steering where the avatar runs in the direction you're pushing the joystick, which is much better.
Fixed camera angles kinda went out of fashion in more recent games though...

Théodore wrote:I wish they would have used more material from this demo in Myst 5 EOA and URU. Oh well, at least we can play it 19 years after

Better late than never ! :D
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