That's all, folks

Anything that isn't directly related to Age Creation but that might be interesting to Age developers.

Re: That's all, folks

Postby andylegate » Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:01 am

Well what Tweek is saying can be seen as hopeful.......


Uhm, I'm not sure what it's hopeful for though.... :?

I mean, waiting to do any action as far as trying to make something like a MORPG like Chacal is describing, or any other thing like that for at least the next 2 months only makes sense, as we need to wait until MOUL is actually shut down (and of course if we need to get permission for the many different ideas and thoughts).
But I don't think that means we can't PLAN or TALK about it either.

The idea here is to keep moral and hopes up! To keep people (explorers) and the Guilds together! So we need to give them hope too! Not promises. I mean I can promise that I will keep making Ages that can be used with Uru CC. That's a promise I can keep, and so can others.
And I think we can promise people that we (The Guilds, and others) will keep looking, talking, and planning on a something for after MOUL.

But I don't want to cling to Cyan for hope of something Tweek. I hope you can understand that. It's not that we don't believe in Cyan. And I'm sure we're all DYING to know what the heck they may be planning, but we've had many, many , many people waiting to hear something since the beginning of December, and what they got to hear yesterday was the worse thing that could have been heard.

So now you're saying "Hey, don't be rash! There may still be hope from Cyan! Keep waiting!"
That's a rather big pill to swallow.

As the saying goes:
"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

I'm not saying we should dash out and fire up some servers. You are very right, we do need to wait on that. But I'm not going to wait around and not try to give people hope of some kind.

If we just sit around waiting again for the next 2 months, not saying anything, not talking about anything, or at least looking into things, and letting people know that we are DOING at least that, then people will fall apart. The guilds will fall apart.

If the Guilds can rise up from the ashes of MOUL, I really, REALLY think that is one thing that all the guilds must adopt and not take after Cyan and GameTap: keeping our mouths shut and not saying anything.

We've all experienced first hand what that does to people and groups. It can destroy them. I want no part of that.

Holding back some details. Sure. Holding back sensitive information, sure. Holding back spoilers, plot lines, stories, etc, etc. Sure.
But to sit back and say nothing? No.
That may be Cyan's and GameTap's way. But I don't think that's a policy that the Guilds should adopt. Not unless our backs are up against the wall and we have no choice in the mater.

So yes, Tweek is right. I agree we can't rush off and start certain things, like trying to get Shards up, or servers. But that doesn't mean we can't talk about it, or plan for it. And to let people KNOW we are at least looking into the possibility (no promisies), and to not throw Uru and they Myst universe out of their lives (Got a friend here.....uhm name is not going to be mentioned, because I'm sure he woke up this morning regretting what he did, but.....after yesterday's announcement, not only did he cancel his GameTap account.......he took all his Myst Game disks out, nailed each CD to a tree and used his gun...... :roll: , yes people are THAT angry about this. I told him he should've used pictures of the GameTap logo).

But I'm not going to look at Tweek's third point, and try to read something into it, and hold my breath. Cyan has taught us that lesson well.

So don't stop talking about it. I'm busy running around trying to cheer people up, turn them on to Uru CC, teach them about our Ages we've been working on, and putting out, just to give them a try, and to help keep the guilds together.

If in the mean time, Cyan works some sort of magic, hey, I'll be the first to jump up and down and throw a big party here at my house! But I'm not going to hold my breath, or buy all that beer just yet. 8-)
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Robert The Rebuilder » Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:28 am

I recommend that, while 60 days go by, we continue to produce ages and make them available via ULM. And we should also continue to meet in cavern, if you haven't already terminated your GameTap account.

After 60 days, if there is no resurrection, then we must pursue the server option if we ever hope to have a multiplayer URU experience again.

If anyone has an existing server option, I recommend contacting Cyan right now about its use.
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Tweek » Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:20 am

My comment about waiting was in regards to the insane amount of talk about starting UU 2 up again (not just here but in the community general).

Continue making and releasing Ages, I'm not saying you should wait there, I just mean in regards to shards and servers.
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby BAD » Tue Feb 05, 2008 11:01 am

LOL, there is no fear of that Tweek. Those who have the knowledge and code to resurrect UU do not want to do that. Many of us who loved UU have made it clear we do not want to see it come back. We are afraid we will just be used again, and abandoned again.

The other options would take a bit more than 60 days to get working properly, so no worries about us firing up our own servers either. So relax. ;)
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Robert The Rebuilder » Tue Feb 05, 2008 11:11 am

Right - I should clarify: UU means authentication, which means that it can be taken away again. Nobody wants that.
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Aloys » Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:07 pm

My opinion is that silence is never a good option, you never make any friends by just keeping people in the dark; the reactions those last months and yesterday (and today) are a good example.
That said I guess 60 days is not that much to wait. And it's not like there's anything we can do to speed things up, or to convince Cyan to change their mind and to speak..
Personally I'll try to complete Ahra Pahts (also somehow the motivation has just suddenly become very low...) but beyond that I'll really have to see what they have up their sleeve to know what I'll do.
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Nek'rahm » Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:21 pm

I agree completely Chacal.

While UU wouldn't have the same following, we could definitely try to keep things moving.

Besides, if word got out about a new Uru game, many would flock back to the game. Plus, if we could run a shard, couldn't we also add our own maps through the work we can do in Blender?

If so, then we could techincally keep things moving.
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Nek'rahm » Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:35 pm

I just read over all the comments and I have another idea.

We have to (in case this doesn't come back) plan for the worst and hope for the best.

By making another form of UU, we can keep the online part going and possibly update it with our own Ages.

Now, I was also thinking that if we do this, we need to alert people in the Bevins and in Ae'gura while we still have a chance. While we do that, we need to have Ages prepared to add to this UU.

Also, I was thinking that as a way to keep people interested... there should be a sub-Guild for each Guild.

Now here's what we have:

Guild of Cartographers
Guild of Greeters
Guild of Maintainers
Guild of Messengers
Guild of Writers

Now, each one would have a corrisponding Sub-Guild. Here's what I had in mind:

Cartographers -> SubGuild of Surveyors
Greeters -> SubGuild of Innovators/Gamers
Maintainers -> SubGuild of Linguists
Messangers -> SubGuild of Artists
Writers -> SubGuild of Book Makers

Here's what each Guild + SubGuild would do:

Cartographers: Map Ages and set up keys considering into effect everything in the Age
---Surveyors: Plot distances through landmarks, noticables and other plants
Greeters: Introduce people to UU2 and speak of it in other prominent Games
---Innovators/Gamers: Design new Games for Jalak, New Games in the Cavern, and new Ideas for things to do in D'ni
Maintainers: Visit and inspect new Ages
---Linguists: Learn D'ni and other languages to allow for translation
Messengers: Pass messages about UU2 as well as cataloging information and archiving events
---Artists: Make designs and artwork concerning the Ages and events ingame (ex. Stained-glass stuff from MOUL)
Writers: Create new Ages for UU2
---Book Makers: Design book covers for the Ages that will be visible in Relto and in the Cavern
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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Kierra » Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:55 pm

Hm, that is quite a bit of division among the guilds. It is a nice idea on paper, but I'm not sure how it would work practically.

For instance, I call myself a Writer. But I am also a Book maker, Cartographer and Maintainer for my own Ages.

No Writer is just one category, especially when it comes to their own Ages.

When it comes to evaluating others Ages, sure, subcategories are feasible. But sub-categories also creates a natural division of resources. Unless all guilds and their subcategories are hosted on the same forum, it might not work. and even then it might be difficult.

I love the Uru community, I really do, but sometimes we have issues with getting on the same page, and working together. Just the nature of the games before Uru. We are essentially a community of lone wolves trying to work together.

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Re: That's all, folks

Postby Chacal » Tue Feb 05, 2008 2:20 pm

It seems we're all on the same page here (red? blue?).

  • Uru is more than just a disposable game for some of us.
  • For this reason, we're willing to work on keeping Uru alive. Again.
  • We're willing to continue writing Ages and learning the art.
  • Presumably the devs are willing to continue developing tools, if only for R&D or just for fun.
  • We're willing to give Cyan a chance for something else, but we're wary because we've been burned before, and we're not necessarily willing to let them control everything this time around.
  • More precisely, we're fed up with corporate speak and we need more transparency.

The option of building and running our own Uru with or without Cyan's collaboration is suddenly appealing, but there is no rush. "With" is easier than "without".
There is the possibility that Cyan (or Ubisoft, or Gametap) will aggressively hold on to their IP and fight us about it. It depends on their hope for a revival.
But in a discussion a few months ago I said something like this: "Let's face it, MOUL is not working. It is entirely depending on new content, and Cyan can't provide it fast enough. Cyan needs our Ages". This is true now more than ever, and I don't see how anyone could revive Uru without us.
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