Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

General debates and discussion about the Guild of Writers and Age creation

Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby kaelisebonrai » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:25 pm

teedyo wrote:
diafero wrote:I also doubt Ubisoft is part of the issue here. Cyan obviously has the necessary rights for the content and the engine, or they could not use it in their own game.

Correct. What they don't have is the rights to URU:CC/ABM/TPoTS and as such cannot endorse, promote or condone hacking on that package/publication/production/instantiation. To do so would imply authority that they just don't have. RIghts to the content is not the same as rights to the production. As such they can only promote 'hacking' on MOUL for which they have full rights to since they got them back from GameTap. Failure to understand this is not a failure on Cyan's part.

But they plan to keep the content under control, and the last we heard about the server architecture was one Shard centrally administrated by Cyan, with fans running their ages' game server on their own machines. And Cyan running the main dataserver. So it would not be legally possible to create a completely independent MOULa Shard with Cyan's content.

Yes, Cyan has stated that they want to maintain a primary dataserver. I think it's understandable. I rather expect them to require that shard owners sign a license agreement to gain permission to access their content. It gives them a small measure of control over their IP. I also expect that those who don't wish to comply with the guidelines for fan material will work around this 'issue'. The only difference is that some will get a 'nod' from Cyan and the 'rogues' won't. I doubt that Cyan will bring a hammer to the party.

As far as pointing certain discussions over here; I think that is pretty clear. It seems a bit enigmatic, but I also think it gives Cyan (almost)plausible deniability if someone were to take notice.


Except, it is not fact that ubi has sole rights at all. The GoG.com release refutes that claim.

This is entirely Cyan's doing. It is no longer excusable to blame everything on the Big Bad Ubi. Especially when the actions are entirely Cyan's doing.
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby teedyo » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:57 pm

I don't see anybody blaming anything on "Big Bad UbI". I just see someone who appears too thick/bull headed to understand the difference between having the rights to content vs. having the rights to a package.
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby kaelisebonrai » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:59 pm

Again, when there is evidence to the contrary to the claim of Ubisoft having sole publishing rights, it is not me who is being thick headed/bull headed. =)
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby JWPlatt » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:03 pm

teedyo wrote:Failure to understand this is not a failure on Cyan's part.

That's a fabulous sentence. Cyan knows their business and their agreements better than anyone.
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby kaelisebonrai » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:05 pm

Of course, however, all we have is fan assumptions that this is Ubi's fault. Not Cyan conformation.

And, again, there is evidence to the contrary.
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby semplerfi » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:30 pm

Aloys wrote:Sidenote: yes, they are not making any friends with this situation and they know it, but it's just a no-win situation for them (and us). Let's just shrug it away and spend more time doing productive things..

1+
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby matthornb2 » Fri Apr 30, 2010 8:11 am

It's a stupid, illogical policy.

And yes, it's Cyan's fault - much as we may hate to say so.

But I think, given some time, we may see formation of a more rational policy from Cyan Worlds; at least the fact that they're reevaluating their anti-hacking policy at all is a good sign.
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby andylegate » Fri Apr 30, 2010 9:10 am

The only thing that upset me about the new policy was how they worded things. The way it is worded now, you could have some Mod who might be heavy handed, or go a bit overboard, and delete posts and whole threads because someone asked a question and someone posted an answer with links to either this form, the GoW Wiki or the GoMa forum.

Now, while people have responded saying "Oh, well that means a specific post or page." that's based upon their view of how one defines the words "Web Page" or "Web Site".
And while RAWA may have said that "we're all on the same page" as far as the mods go, some mods over there have shown that not only do they not seem to be on the same page, but their reading a whole different book!

And that leads to the other problem: "A certain Mod decides to just completely delete a post because it had a link to let's say, the GoW. The person that had their post deleted could complain and say that the link was simply to the index of the GoW forum, not a specific page or post. Complaints about the mods have fell on deaf ears for years now.....especially when you don't have your post to show in the first place. But now, with the way the policy is written, the mod in question can simply quote the forum policy saying that the post violated this policy."

They don't want us to talk about hacking Uru:CC/POTS over there. Fine, okay, got ya. Talking about hacking MOUL is fine however......even though we don't have enough to get a lot of hacking done just yet (they gave us the Food (plugin) but not the plate and silverware (a way to test things made with said plugin)). Okay, fine.

Getting people over on the MOUL forum that have not been here yet to know that there are a LOT of people over here that are experienced at making Ages, programing, etc, etc is my main concern. New people, or people that have been gone for a long time that are interested in making new content, or at the very least wanting to experience new content that is fan made, need to know how to do it (and for now that means having Uru:CC/POTS, and using tools such as Drizzle and OfflineKI). We don't want them thinking that being able to do any of that stuff is MONTHS and MONTHS of more waiting. In truth, they can do it NOW.

But a over zealous mod would be able to keep those people in the dark. And they (the mods) were just given a loaded gun to do so.

Don't get me wrong. For years Cyan has never even acknowledged what we do with Uru. And while now that they finally have responded, it was not what I hoped for partly, but I was pleased to see that they DID say it was okay to start hacking and working on MOUL:a.

And I'm sure that many of us know that while Cyan as a company has never acknowledged what we do with Uru, many of the people there as individuals have. Mark (aka Chogon) has said many times at how amazed he is at the things we produce (Ages, Tools, Modifications). He even posted on the MOUL Forum that he was amazed at TheMagician's video tutorials, and told me in a PM that he sure wished that they'd had my Max tutorials that I'm making for their artists back when they were building Uru.

I don't think too many people are going to forget all the hard work and effort that people here have put in. While it may be a taboo subject on MOUL, most people (at least those that have been involved with trying to makes Ages, and those who just wanted to play them) who have been here, the GoMa know and won't forget.

To me, the GoW Plugin for Blender, Drizzle, the OfflineKI, PlasmaShop, H'Uru, PrpShop and the ALCUGS servers were practice. All of us that have worked on or with these things are better prepared to work on what is coming up: Hacking and modifying MOUL:a.

I know for a fact that if it had not been for the tools I listed above, there would be NO way I could have made the tutorials that I've been making for Max. So without all of your hard work and dedication to hacking Uru in the first place, I would not even be here.
So thanks from me anyways. I'm sure others will feel the same way.
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby D'nial » Fri Apr 30, 2010 11:15 am

kaelisebonrai wrote:Except, it is not fact that ubi has sole rights at all. The GoG.com release refutes that claim.

Have they actively said that Ubisoft does not own Uru CC anymore, or is the evidence just a lack of documentation?
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Re: Cyan's Updated Forum Policies

Postby Ranting Thespian » Fri Apr 30, 2010 2:37 pm

D'nial wrote:
kaelisebonrai wrote:Except, it is not fact that ubi has sole rights at all. The GoG.com release refutes that claim.

Have they actively said that Ubisoft does not own Uru CC anymore, or is the evidence just a lack of documentation?



Again, I have the downloaded GOG.com game. When you start, you see the UBISOFT logo! That logo confirms that they have some rights in someway to the game. Just because GOG.com doesn't have the exact words on the document, the logo in the game proves that they have some legal rights to the game.
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