About Spawn Points

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About Spawn Points

Postby Ehren » Tue May 13, 2008 9:32 pm

I was getting some help from someone to make a basic age with just a plane in it and export to use in game, but it never has worked yet.

I have gotten to the point where I can export age files, but apparently just because I have a .age file doesn't mean it will run in Uru. I have gotten no Errors from Uru when trying to link to the age, it just crashes to desktop after showing a loading bar for a quick second.

I think one of the problems I'm having is with adding a Spawn Point, when I click to add one I get this message:

Adding a new SpawnPoint
scene.link<ob> deprecated!
use scene.objects.link<ob> instead

I am guessing that means something went wrong since it didn't give me a "Done! Successfully added..." message, so I was wondering if anyone knew what this "deprecated" thing ment?
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby Trylon » Tue May 13, 2008 10:38 pm

it merely means that the blender people made a new way to do a trick we use in pyprp, and that they might remove the old way in a new version of blender
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby Robert The Rebuilder » Wed May 14, 2008 6:36 am

Ehren: did it actually add the spawn point? To check, look in layer 2.

Also, what sequence prefix number did you use for your age?

Another question: did you copy all of your age's files (.age, .prp, .fni, .sum) to the dat folder, or just the .age file?
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby Ehren » Wed May 14, 2008 9:11 am

Yes a Spawn Point was added.

But I don't know about the Sequence Prefix thing. How do I add or change one?
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby andylegate » Wed May 14, 2008 9:56 am

In Blender, change one of your windows to the Text Editor.

Then find the updown arrows and change it to "Book" This will show the text file that is your Book Settings. Look for the line that has the Presequence number. It's normally defaulted to 100. Change that to something well above 100.

That's all you have to do.
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby Robert The Rebuilder » Wed May 14, 2008 12:33 pm

andylegate wrote:Change that to something well above 100.


Actually, it would be better if you obtained a unique sequence prefix number. Even though this is just a test age, you don't want to conflict with another fan-created age's sequence prefix (which is why you have the crash in the first place).

Boblishman explains how to get a new prefix in this tutorial.
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby Paradox » Wed May 14, 2008 4:13 pm

Okay, this is entirely unacceptable now. (not you Robert, just the suggestion that you posted)
The sequence prefix list is already filled with Ages that will never be released, and will never be finished. Most of them are probably test Ages as Ehren is trying to build.

So why do we continue to suggest that everyone run out and grab a prefix for their untextured-plane-and-spawnpoint world?

What if we reserved a set of prefixes (around 10 of them) to be used only for testing Ages? Similar to how a router uses 192.168.X.X for local computers, we could have a set of prefixes for Ages that should only exist on the builder's computer. They are not meant to be released or shared, but meant to check that features are working correctly.

If my test Age has prefix 440, and Robert's test Age has the same prefix, it's not a problem unless I try to load Robert's Age (or vice versa, or someone tries to install both Ages). This sequence prefix thing is quickly becoming insane, and should have been organized back in 2005 when PyPRP was first released.

IMO, it would be much better to hold off on reserving a "valid" prefix until you are actually distributing the Age via ULM, and then ULM can generate one for you. That way, only released Ages would be taking up space on the list of prefixes.
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby Aloys » Wed May 14, 2008 6:44 pm

I partially agree. The Alcugs list is clogged with useless Ages, as most likely 98% of them will never see the light of day. This is almost like squatting :p
But how high can the list go anyway? 65536 I guess? If so it is tempting to think that we can register as much as we want.. And even by registering a lot we are not likely to use all the available numbers.. hmm..

Statistics time!
(I obviously can't know the numbers for the ULM list, although I guess they are much lower. So I can only talk with the Alcugs list as a reference..)
Right now there are exactly 262 numbers registered on the Alcugs list. I count a bit over 30 numbers that are actively used (ie: released Ages, or test Ages belonging to active forum members). Probably more are 'actively' used, but even if it is around 50 that's less than 20%; and half of those are test Ages. So we have around 90% of uselessly registered numbers. Ouch. But again, thats 'only' 262 numbers out of 65536.. Less than 0.4% registered over two years and a half. If numbers keeps being registered at this speed we will run out of numbers around the year 2630. :) (yes, I actually calculated that :P ) Also over 40% of those numbers were registered just during the first two months following the release of PyPRP (October/December 2005). That was the initial 'gold rush' and logically things have been slowing down noticably after that.

I agree this Alcugs list is a mess, but I think the real problem comes from the fact that we can *see* it, and it looks like a mess; but given the very high number of avaible Prefixes there isn't a real danger of running out of those any soon.. (unless somehow the number of active Writers suddenly goes through the roof; which would actually be quite cool) I know you want to prepare the future, but there is no real danger IMO. (Although I certainly don't mean to support the curent anarchy.)

What if we reserved a set of prefixes (around 10 of them) to be used only for testing Ages?
That's an interesting idea, but I like the possibily of registering numbers for a test Age (for the record I have only 1 and I plan to keep it that way). And I think other people do too. Even if it's just a test Age it's something that can be seen as 'personnal' and people may want to have their own number for it.. (Even though, as you mention, most people will never actually release it.). I stick with a single test Age because that's all I really need, and I really think of this Age as a 'real' Age, something I want to keep and that I may release one day (if only just for fun). So I need a unique ID for it. :( (Matter of fact, I'm surprised that not more people have registered a test Age.. how do you guys test your stuff?)

IMO, it would be much better to hold off on reserving a "valid" prefix until you are actually distributing the Age via ULM, and then ULM can generate one for you.
I agree with that. Although I fear it will be difficult to enforce that policy.. If only for one thing: people who work on several Ages at the same time (and I wouldn't be surprised if many of us do) need to register a separate ID for each Age if they want to be able to have them all in Uru. That's probably where your idea of having a fixed public set of prefixes would work (we might need more than 10 just to be safe). This sandbox lot would allow people to test and export freely their Ages before final release. Your idea makes sense..

(In the end however unless we put in some technicall block (through the ULM site) we can't control what people want. If they want to register 28 numbers just because 'why the heck not' there's not much we can do.. We can only update the Wiki(wikis?) and make sure to tell people each time they ask..)
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby boblishman » Thu May 15, 2008 4:41 am

Paradox wrote:IMO, it would be much better to hold off on reserving a "valid" prefix until you are actually distributing the Age via ULM, and then ULM can generate one for you. That way, only released Ages would be taking up space on the list of prefixes.


I agree that the present "new" method means that people can request as many numbers as they like ... (which means that it is open to "abuse" by "wreckless" witers)

.... this is why I put the following in the tutorial ...

"PLEASE NOTE: You can request additional sequence prefixes at any time in the future so I suggest to get you started you simply request a block of 5 numbers. This will give you 5 unique numbers enabling you to write five different ages at the same time. (If you need more sequence prefixes in the future for additional ages, simply return to the website and request another block.) "

I put this to try and prevent people taking an unnecessary number of sequence prefixes, and I think we should give credit to the intelligence of fellow writers to not do so.

(I would however suggest that the drop-down option to select 10 be removed ... I can't see many people working on 10 Ages at the same time ...
(however, the option to get a block of 5 numbers should stay, because it means that people can work on a "new" personal Age and a "testing" age at the same time - without crashing to desktop. It also emphasises the importance of each of their own Ages having different numbers ...)
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Re: About Spawn Points

Postby Whilyam » Thu May 15, 2008 11:43 am

I agree with Paradox on this. I use 411 for any age when I first test it as I'm never going to download "Tyion's Test age". I just name it "test.age" and change that name and the sequence prefix to something different when it's released.
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