Rand's visit and news for Age Creators

[ddb174]

OOC guilds are an awful idea, really. Nothing gets done, and you have all the pettiness and politics you would expect. The current system of people doing what they want on their own works much better. And it sounds like Rand is still fond of having guilds determine which Ages to allow, so he doesn't seem to have learned anything on that front :P That's almost as obviously terrible an idea as their "DRC Liaisons" idea was.

About Pots->Moul conversion: as I say, that will be done when we have the source code and a working client/server with source. But that would not include PhysX, as it is not open-source. So there's no point, in my view, of figuring out the redundant cooked data that PhysX stores along with the principal data, as what we really want is to convert Havok->ODE.

As I said elsewhere: Tell Rand that if he wants you to build content for free for his business, they should actually do what they said they would and open-source the tools.

[Aloys]

it sounds like Rand is still fond of having guilds determine which Ages to allow, so he doesn't seem to have learned anything on that front That's almost as obviously terrible an idea as their "DRC Liaisons" idea was.

As long as they are running MOUL it's legitimate that they want to see some form of control over what is published. This is not Second Life.

As I said elsewhere: Tell Rand that if he wants you to build content for free for his business, they should actually do what they said they would and open-source the tools.

But how? Rand is a very friendly guy when you can talk to him face to face, but he isn't known for answering is emails fast.. Going through other Cyan peeps hasn't proven to succesful either.

The best (and only) solution I see of is that of a open letter. An informed diplomatic friendly text where we underline our respective needs and common objectives. And being an open letter we'd send it to him directly and we'd also post it here and on the MOUL forum for public support & discussion. Make it something big and official (at least as official as our flexible group can be), but not invasive.
That might make them more aware of the situation.

[BAD]

Jeese, relax people.

First of all, everything people are suggesting is possible and nothing is set in stone yet. The way I see it the people who want to do their own thing will do so regardless of what is released.

Also those who want to mess about with the "Official" server, go and have at it. You can have all the guilds, clubs, meetings, and politics you want.

The only thing I would find interesting to see is who actually makes the best stuff.

I can tell you know, that bickering before anything is announced or released has been the cornerstone of the Uru fan community. Wouldn't it be nice if we just relaxed had some nice discussions about how cool the ages we'll make are, and defied history for once?

[ZURI]

A little excitement is a good thing Bad. It'll be ok. Cyan threw a porkchop to a pack of wolves. There is going to be a lot of speculation.

On your note though, I agree wholeheartedly. Look at how well made a lot of the fan ages are. Now imagine how amazing they will look after we have a fully working toolset (with all the extras that we currently lack.)

[ddb174]

it sounds like Rand is still fond of having guilds determine which Ages to allow, so he doesn't seem to have learned anything on that front :P That's almost as obviously terrible an idea as their "DRC Liaisons" idea was.

As long as they are running MOUL it's legitimate that they want to see some form of control over what is published. This is not Second Life.

As I said elsewhere: Tell Rand that if he wants you to build content for free for his business, they should actually do what they said they would and open-source the tools.

But how? Rand is a very friendly guy when you can talk to him face to face, but he isn't known for answering is emails fast.. :) Going through other Cyan peeps hasn't proven to succesful either.

Legitimate? Meaning what, not illegal? :P Sure, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea to let some fans control other fans. And Rand isn't really friendly; just a fake sort of "I want to maintain the image of being friendly and approachable" friendly. I've seen my share of people just like him.

[Chacal]

The idea of fans controlling other fans has created heated debates here in the past, a lot of which was my own doing.
I have not changed my mind and will brutally attack this idea whenever it is suggested. I will have none of ideas such as secret committees, Cyan communicating privately with Guild Masters, etc. Any and all information must be made public immediately, regardless of Cyan's wishes on that matter. As far as I'm concerned, this is not negociable.

QA is another thing. I have no qualms over the idea of groups, say GoW and GoMa, doing QA on new Ages. This is beta-testing, not control. But this must only include QA, not license enforcing or IP protection, not verifying continuity or canon.

[Aloys]

Rand is a genuinely nice guy. You really shoudn't form an opinion if you haven't met him. I actually happen to think that deserves him professionally at times : he often tries to satisfy fan's desires when it's not always possible.. That's why he sometimes sincerely promises things or hints at things that can't materialize later on. Sometimes a good 'don't count on it!' is better. (the eternal 'managing expectaions' dilemna..)

Back to my original point : my concern is that he didn't mention the one (only?) thing we are interested in : Open source. The idea of having custom Ages in MOUL is nice and all, but without actual visible progress on the Open source front it justs looks like a vague idea.. Also it doesn't seem like another important message is being heard: we can help with the OSUru project, if some code needs to be pluged out or rewritten.
It's great that Uru is starting again (and I'm actually surprised at the amount of ressources they're throwing at it) but other older projects (open source) have yet to materialize. If the OS front had made any progress since it's first been announced MOUL would already have been brought back online long ago and it would already have seen enhancements and bug fixes... (Sure it wouldn't be a central official Shard like we have now; but I don't think that warranted the wait..).

I know that Uru is just getting started again, and we have to be patient etc etc... I know that all too well, but at the end of the day we are not getting any younger. The first time the toolset was hinted at was before M5 EoA: 5 years ago.. Can I get a 'skeleton avatar with cobwebs' smiley please? If there is anything we can do to speed things up we have to try.

[ddb174]

Yes, I'm not interested in this shard either: though it is nice to have a public one for people to join, it's isn't a great one. And it *isn't* a step towards open-source, as that indicates that it is somehow closer to open-source. E.g. if they had said that they had now identified all 3rd party code, that would have been a step. But this shard in no way helps with open-sourcing. Ah well, we can just wait.

Chacal: that why I like seeing you: it's great to have someone watching around for such things!

[Aloys]

I finally managed to log in and I had a pretty sad experience: I had fun for around 10 minutes before finally realizing that there is just nothing to do here... It is still the same old game with the same content. The same Ages I've gone through so many times. I got my Ki, I litterally ran through Garrison, not looking at anything, I then linked back to my Relto, once there I thought I could add a couple pages to spice it up but I really didn't feel like going through all the Journey Ages again.. I linked to the City, and there I realized that to me this is what Uru amounts to now: a 3D chat in a dead environment.

I thought seeing the Cavern again full of people would feel great, but it's exactly the opposite: it feels even more empty. It feels like a scratched vinyl repeating itself..
I've known this for a while, but somehow I just finally actually realized it...

The IC works going on is really what I enjoy the most these days, but personally I really need the ability to turn that into something concrete in the game. Cyan's discourse is that MOULagain is just a first step towards that. And I really hope so, because as it stand, as far as I am concerned I don't see the point of logging in.

If someone (Dox?) manages to create an external KI application that may just be the strongest connection I'll have with Uru until there's some Open Source progress.

I'm really sounding like a cranky old man these last two days, and I don't like it, but I suddenly really feel tired regarding Uru..

[BAD]

I finally managed to log in and I had a pretty sad experience: I had fun for around 10 minutes before finally realizing that there is just nothing to do here... It is still the same old game with the same content. The same Ages I've gone through so many times. I got my Ki, I litterally ran through Garrison, not looking at anything, I then linked back to my Relto, once there I thought I could add a couple pages to spice it up but I really didn't feel like going through all the Journey Ages again.. I linked to the City, and there I realized that to me this is what Uru amounts to now: a 3D chat in a dead environment.

I thought seeing the Cavern again full of people would feel great, but it's exactly the opposite: it feels even more empty. It feels like a scratched vinyl repeating itself..
I've known this for a while, but somehow I just finally actually realized it...

The IC works going on is really what I enjoy the most these days, but personally I really need the ability to turn that into something concrete in the game. Cyan's discourse is that MOULagain is just a first step towards that. And I really hope so, because as it stand, as far as I am concerned I don't see the point of logging in.

If someone (Dox?) manages to create an external KI application that may just be the strongest connection I'll have with Uru until there's some Open Source progress.

I'm really sounding like a cranky old man these last two days, and I don't like it, but I suddenly really feel tired regarding Uru..

I guess two years wasn't long enough time to want to replay the game for you? >_>