DLC - D'ni Location (Creation) Contest

[GPNMilano]

Because of my own personal beliefs I will no longer be participating in this contest.

[Aloys]

Open date is - When we decide, on the criteria.
End Date: End of Augst.
Cyan Content: Allowed. Do whatever the pants you want, just respect canon.
Theme: D'ni locations.
Explorable Size: Hood Size or Smaller.
Prizes: Bragging Rights.

That sounds about right to me. Ending it august should give enough time for people to complete their works.

Because of my own personal beliefs I will no longer be participating in this contest.

What? Seriously? Why?

Anything I'm missing?

pants

[GPNMilano]

What? Seriously? Why?

Cyan Content: Allowed. Do whatever the pants you want, just respect canon.

I think I've clarified my stance on this on more then one occasion. I will not compromise my stance.

[Nadnerb]

Because if your stance is compromised, you will fall over.

Seriously though, the rule doesn't say you have to use Cyan content, you can do whatever you feel comfortable with. Seems more like you're just boycotting the contest because people might do things you disapprove of. I'd hardly expect this from someone who has made extensive use of Cyan assets in their ages in the past. Sure, say you had permission from Rand himself. What difference does it make in the scope of a contest? Why would you continue to even participate in this forum if it's denizens consistently endorse doing things without Cyan's permission?

And Kaelis, I think people might appreciate it if you stopped trying to impose the values of your previous "modding communities" on theirs. You are not only being unnecessarily confrontational, but also complaining when this causes people to lash out at you. Your inability to comprehend the difference people see between modification and creation is really quite baffling. Just saying "it's all modding" when you are the only one defining the word is nonsensical. What makes you think that this is a "modding community" as you personally define it? Why should we start acting like your definition of a "modding community"?

[kaelisebonrai]

What? Seriously? Why?

Cyan Content: Allowed. Do whatever the pants you want, just respect canon.

I think I've clarified my stance on this on more then one occasion. I will not compromise my stance.

No one, anywhere, said you had to use Cyan Content, it is merely /allowed/...

Seeing as you've used it, extensively, before, Chloe, it does seem a little hypocritical. =P

@Nad: Not trying to "impose" anything, merely encourage. =) Simply because it is a more free (as in, freedom) and open state of being. =P As far as I'm concerned, re: modification, and creation, neither is somehow /better/ than the other, as as far as I'm concerned one can be just as creative, modifying existing assets, as you can be, creating new assets. creation is not somehow "better", than the modification of existing assets.

I am not being at all confrontational, and I'd appreciate it if you do not continue to suggest that I am. This is a modding community by its very nature, regardless of whether this is recognised by members of this community. We add/change things to/in a video game -- This is "modding". I understand that people see a difference, I just don't agree that this "difference" is in any way important, or relevant.

[kaelisebonrai]

Contest is now open. =)

[GPNMilano]

Since people seem to like assuming my reasons for withdrawing without asking me to actually justify why, I will justify just to clear the air and not derail this topic any further than it has.

The rule of using Cyan's content has nothing to do with forcing me to. Nor does it have anything to do with having Cyan's "permission" to do so. I am not against using Cyan's content. As people have pointed out I have done so on more than one occasion and will continue to do so. I do so under a strict set of guidelines that I developed for myself as a rule of thumb. The rule for this contest of "anything goes just don't disrupt cannon" is in direction violation of the guidelines I imposed upon myself. Since

a. It causes a ethical dilemma for me, a rule that the contest has, is in direct opposition to a rule I have given myself.
b. To continue in the contest after making the rules that I use to govern my creative influences would be hypocritical IMO.

I decided that the best route for me was simply to withdraw from the contest and wish everyone luck and hope that the best location wins. I hope that explains it a bit more.

[kaelisebonrai]

How does this break a rule you've set for yourself, more specifically... what /is/ that rule?

"canon" is a wide, vague concept, and it is for that specific REASON, I chose that wording, rather than "follow RAWA's guidelines".

I can change the wording, further to "please try and stick to the setting of D'ni", if it would please you?

I don't understand how it would break any rules, however, if you were to explain, it would be more pleasant, than effectively boycotting the contest. =P Especially when you said you have "clarified my stance on more than one occasion", which has ALWAYS, been about the use of Cyan content, not any other apparent "rule" you have set yourself, which anything being allowed in the contest, as long as it /respects/ canon, apparently disrupts. O_o

[kaelisebonrai]

Also, note, when we get a jury, these are the core things, imo, that should be considered:

Immersion, (how well it fits with the styling of the D'ni civilisation, or other places within the caverns of D'ni (?)), stability, sound design (?), general game design / level design (how well it fits within the stated purpose).

What do we think?

[GPNMilano]

How does this break a rule you've set for yourself, more specifically... what /is/ that rule?

"canon" is a wide, vague concept, and it is for that specific REASON, I chose that wording, rather than "follow RAWA's guidelines".

I can change the wording, further to "please try and stick to the setting of D'ni", if it would please you?

I don't understand how it would break any rules, however, if you were to explain, it would be more pleasant, than effectively boycotting the contest. =P Especially when you said you have "clarified my stance on more than one occasion", which has ALWAYS, been about the use of Cyan content, not any other apparent "rule" you have set yourself, which anything being allowed in the contest, as long as it /respects/ canon, apparently disrupts. O_o

My own personal rules that I adhere to when using Cyan's content are thus Again these are only my rules. In the past when someone uses Cyan's content in a way that violates that way I believe it should be used, I have spoken up in the hopes that others would look at my rules and see the value in them. There have also been a time or two when someone violates not this rule but a even greater rule of the form in which they distribute Cyan's content (IE distribution externally from the Plasma engine that becomes freely available to ANYONE rather than between two individuals or a small group)

The rules that are in violation are this:

1. I use Cyan's artwork (It's textures) when it falls to certain staples of D'ni (cavern rock, bannisters etc) and when the textures are part of a staple of D'ni.
2. I use Cyan's models ONLY when those models are a staple of D'ni. Imagers. Linking Books. Nexus pedestals Book pedestals etc. Basically if the model has been used in more than two distinct areas In D'ni it becomes a staple of D'ni life. It's like a lamp post on a street corner. Most of them will look the same regardless of what city you go to.

The rule of "Cyan Content: Allowed. Do whatever the pants you want, just respect canon." is in direction violation of rules 1 and 2 because of "do whatever the pants you want". Others in the contest will go beyond the two rules I set for myself in regards to using Cyan's content. That's okay with me. To each is own. I don't expect anyone to follow the same rules I do. However the ethical dilemma then for me becomes this. In order to win, and I would want to win, I'd have to either (A). Level the playing field by breaking my own rule and go with the contests rule. Thus causing a moral problem and being hypocritical of myself. Or (B) Go above and beyond my self, work really REALLY hard and create something truly breathtaking.

I will not do (A), and (B) introduces the problem of if I lose the contest I'd be really disappointed and consistently be nagged by the doubt that if I had done (A) I probably would have won. Since I don't wish to suffer the moral dilemma nor the internal struggle I will inevitably face the only solution IMO is not to participate and simply enjoy this as a spectator. Perhaps down the road I will decide to start my own contest that uses my rules. That's all.