Guesses on the accepted file format for Age Creation tools?

[Jennifer_P]

Heya, I have a question for the experts about what kinds of files Cyan's official Age Creation tools might accept. Specifically, how about 3DsMax files? Could those be dropped straight into the game, more or less...? Any clue? Thanks...

[Grogyan]

.blend and .3ds to prp, maybe.
A single executable?

What about tying them into Relto? Similar to how ULM works?
How would we test the Ages we write, a new dedicated sever?

[BAD]

This is quite the quagmire of a discussion to start, but it is inevitable.

My feelings are that we will not be given age creation tools from Cyan. I'll list my reasons.

1) Cyan is busy enough just trying to get new content to us they make themselves. Unless they release the tools they use in their studio (highly unlikely), they will have to build ones taking time away from developing content for MOUL.

2) There is no need for them to make them. We have many talented coders, and designers in the fan community. We already have tools to make ages (albeit they are still a bit crude), but they are already making improvements to them, and with the creation of the GOW, those projects will most likely increase in speed and usefulness.

3) If they released something that has limitless freedom, it could very well cause havoc for the Live servers if someone was inclined to do so. You would basically have a road map to how MOUL works, thus allowing you to figure out how to break it. If they make the tools to restrictive, people will either find ways to unlock the restrictions, or become uninterested as it won't allow you to do what you want. Carefully developing a happy medium would take a lot of time and planning.

4) Using fan built tools will be a big vote of trust in the content creation community. This will mend a lot of fences, believe me. If Cyan is smart, they should go this route.

Now I know many people here believe Cyan will release tools of some sort, and I don't mean to say you are wrong, I simply don't feel that that will happen, so please do not get mad at me.

As for the kind of files they would have you use, that is a very tough question.

Lets say for this discussion Cyan plans on releasing tools.

If they show support for a program that needs to be purchased, like 3D Studio Max, they will get a lot of flack from those who can not afford that software. On the other hand, if they favor freeware like Blender, they may get some flack from those who dislike using Blender. A third option is acquiring a 3rd party creation software, adapting it to work with Uru files, and releasing that at a small price, or free. Then they could tweek it to give us as much or as little power as they want us to have.

The third option would be the best for them, but also be the longest and hardest to develop. Even using already built software would require a lot of modifying and testing. Not to mention the money it would cost for the rights to use and distribute.

They could also just release plugins for a few different programs. THat would take more time, but would probably be easier than what I explained above.

[Pryftan]

I think the idea of Age Creation tools is that, as Rand has said, Cyan would give us what they use. In other words, .3ds to .prp. I think if they give us anything that'll be what they give us.. as BAD said they don't really have time for much else. I doubt they'll add .blend support, considering we mainly use Blender due to the fact that it's free and lets you add Python scripts just like Plasma does.

[Goofy]

One idea that cyan could do is ask the community experts what parts they are having problems with and give them a hand to complete the blender plugin. If they are using 3dmax, Not sure if it is, but I have Gmax its suppose to be a lite version of 3dmax without all the bells and whistle. From what I've seen of 3dmax the interfaces are very simular if not exact.

Also they could have been working on the tools since beta for all we know. keeping them quite till they know for sure they can do it. One or two people could of been working on them all this time. whether they are what some expect remains to be seen.

[BAD]

I know that Cyan was using 3D Studio Max for Uru at one point. I believe it was 3DSM 4. I would say it is very likely they are still using 3DSM.

[Paradox]

All of Cyan's tools are very tightly bound to the 3DS Max program. The tools rely directly on the Plasma engine library, and everything is stored in the .max files. (All of the animations, textures, sounds, python links, clickables, responders, geometry, regions, collision, lights, and even random stuff like particles and seek-points). There is no way that Cyan could release the toolset without requiring 3DS Max, since they use a custom material editor and the entire export process is designed around Max's internal object system.

(Information as taken from Brice Tebbs (Lead developer of Plasma during the HeadSpin days) during a chat in CyanChat: Link to Chatlog )

[Jennifer_P]

Thanks for posting that log, Paradox, it was very interesting indeed! I wondered about how the subworlds on Gahreesen were implemented...now I know. Got anymore chatlogs of this sort of stuff? I'd love to look through them, if you have time to send them to me.

And this: "keyToReadInAndThrowAwaySoJustLiveWithIt"
Hysterical!!

Thanks everyone!

[Jennifer_P]

(Oh, here are some at your site when I remove /Brice2/ from the URL...nevermind)

[Grogyan]

That quite a conumdrim isn't it, how would Cyan realease its tool, which we can't use, and how to integrate all you guys hard work and not to have Ages come into Live.

I still think that, with all the work on the PyPrp project, Cyan has at least someone working on a tool, that would convert .blend files, into a format that is similar to their tool, and then convert it to prp.
While at the same the same tool can handle 3d tudio .max files natively, should there be anyone that can afford their own personal copy.